Relating to the President and obstruction, were Mueller's conclusions preordained? Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 23, 2019 at 23:30 UTC (7:30pm US/Eastern)What would happen if the same person were elected both President and Vice President?Can presidential pardons be made and then classified as secret to avoid making the pardon public?What is the role of the White House Chief Strategist in the US National Security Council?What can happen to President Trump in light of Comey's hearing?Why didn't Trump veto H.R. 3364 since he considers it “significantly flawed” with “clearly unconstitutional provisions”?Does the Electoral College system really favor low population areas?Is Fox News correct that Mueller shouldn't be going after a campaign finance violation?Why was the “value-added model” algorithm kept secret?Was the Walsh special counsel report (on the Iran Contra) released completely uncensored?Did the IG’s office say its audit of the use of Confidential Human Sources was prompted by Trump?
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Relating to the President and obstruction, were Mueller's conclusions preordained?
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 23, 2019 at 23:30 UTC (7:30pm US/Eastern)What would happen if the same person were elected both President and Vice President?Can presidential pardons be made and then classified as secret to avoid making the pardon public?What is the role of the White House Chief Strategist in the US National Security Council?What can happen to President Trump in light of Comey's hearing?Why didn't Trump veto H.R. 3364 since he considers it “significantly flawed” with “clearly unconstitutional provisions”?Does the Electoral College system really favor low population areas?Is Fox News correct that Mueller shouldn't be going after a campaign finance violation?Why was the “value-added model” algorithm kept secret?Was the Walsh special counsel report (on the Iran Contra) released completely uncensored?Did the IG’s office say its audit of the use of Confidential Human Sources was prompted by Trump?
On Page 2 of Volume II, Mueller writes:

(emphasis added)
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
united-states mueller-investigation
add a comment |
On Page 2 of Volume II, Mueller writes:

(emphasis added)
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
united-states mueller-investigation
add a comment |
On Page 2 of Volume II, Mueller writes:

(emphasis added)
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
united-states mueller-investigation
On Page 2 of Volume II, Mueller writes:

(emphasis added)
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
united-states mueller-investigation
united-states mueller-investigation
edited 1 hour ago
JJJ
7,23922660
7,23922660
asked 2 hours ago
BobEBobE
2,9961930
2,9961930
add a comment |
add a comment |
2 Answers
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Yes, but. Mueller made it crystal clear that he abided by the Department of Justice policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted -- or at least should not, because it basically gets in the way of running the country. That being said, take a look at footnote #1,091, which essentially invites to indict Trump once he's no longer in office.
The text in footnote 1091 on page 178 of the second volume reads:
A possible remedy through impeachment for abuses of power would not substitute for potential
criminal liability after a President leaves office. Impeachment would remove a President from office, but
would not address the underlying culpability of the conduct or serve the usual purposes of the criminal law.
Indeed, the Impeachment Judgment Clause recognizes that criminal law plays an independent role in
addressing an official’s conduct, distinct from the political remedy of impeachment. See U.S. CONST. ART.
I, § 3, cl. 7. Impeachment is also a drastic and rarely invoked remedy, and Congress is not restricted to
relying only on impeachment, rather than making criminal law applicable to a former President, as OLC
has recognized. A Sitting President’s Amenability to Indictment and Criminal Prosecution, 24 Op. O.L.C.
at 255 (“Recognizing an immunity from prosecution for a sitting President would not preclude such
prosecution once the President’s term is over or he is otherwise removed from office by resignation or
impeachment.
”).
Also, there's a nugget on page 8 of volume II:
if we had confidence after a thorough investigation of the facts that the President clearly did not commit obstruction of justice, we would so state.
I took the liberty of adding the note you refer to, it was a bit ambiguous as there's another footnote 1091 in the first volume that wasn't as interesting. ;)
– JJJ
1 hour ago
@JJJ - Just noticed. Thanks for digging it up!
– Denis de Bernardy
1 hour ago
add a comment |
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
Yes, it does. Page 8 (page 220 in the pdf) of the second volume contains the following lines (just before the conclusion heading):
Finally, we concluded that in the rare case in
which a criminal investigation of the President’s conduct is justified, inquiries to determine
whether the President acted for a corrupt motive should not impermissibly chill his performance
of his constitutionally assigned duties. The conclusion that Congress may apply the obstruction
laws to the President’s corrupt exercise of the powers of office accords with our constitutional
system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law.
I (and some American media outlets, e.g. Vox) interpret that as saying Congress should be the one to determine whether to bring criminal charges. The second volume goes into much more detail, for example under the Legal Defenses To The Application Of Obstruction-Of-Justice Statutes To
The President heading starting on page 159 of the second volume.
add a comment |
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
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votes
Yes, but. Mueller made it crystal clear that he abided by the Department of Justice policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted -- or at least should not, because it basically gets in the way of running the country. That being said, take a look at footnote #1,091, which essentially invites to indict Trump once he's no longer in office.
The text in footnote 1091 on page 178 of the second volume reads:
A possible remedy through impeachment for abuses of power would not substitute for potential
criminal liability after a President leaves office. Impeachment would remove a President from office, but
would not address the underlying culpability of the conduct or serve the usual purposes of the criminal law.
Indeed, the Impeachment Judgment Clause recognizes that criminal law plays an independent role in
addressing an official’s conduct, distinct from the political remedy of impeachment. See U.S. CONST. ART.
I, § 3, cl. 7. Impeachment is also a drastic and rarely invoked remedy, and Congress is not restricted to
relying only on impeachment, rather than making criminal law applicable to a former President, as OLC
has recognized. A Sitting President’s Amenability to Indictment and Criminal Prosecution, 24 Op. O.L.C.
at 255 (“Recognizing an immunity from prosecution for a sitting President would not preclude such
prosecution once the President’s term is over or he is otherwise removed from office by resignation or
impeachment.
”).
Also, there's a nugget on page 8 of volume II:
if we had confidence after a thorough investigation of the facts that the President clearly did not commit obstruction of justice, we would so state.
I took the liberty of adding the note you refer to, it was a bit ambiguous as there's another footnote 1091 in the first volume that wasn't as interesting. ;)
– JJJ
1 hour ago
@JJJ - Just noticed. Thanks for digging it up!
– Denis de Bernardy
1 hour ago
add a comment |
Yes, but. Mueller made it crystal clear that he abided by the Department of Justice policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted -- or at least should not, because it basically gets in the way of running the country. That being said, take a look at footnote #1,091, which essentially invites to indict Trump once he's no longer in office.
The text in footnote 1091 on page 178 of the second volume reads:
A possible remedy through impeachment for abuses of power would not substitute for potential
criminal liability after a President leaves office. Impeachment would remove a President from office, but
would not address the underlying culpability of the conduct or serve the usual purposes of the criminal law.
Indeed, the Impeachment Judgment Clause recognizes that criminal law plays an independent role in
addressing an official’s conduct, distinct from the political remedy of impeachment. See U.S. CONST. ART.
I, § 3, cl. 7. Impeachment is also a drastic and rarely invoked remedy, and Congress is not restricted to
relying only on impeachment, rather than making criminal law applicable to a former President, as OLC
has recognized. A Sitting President’s Amenability to Indictment and Criminal Prosecution, 24 Op. O.L.C.
at 255 (“Recognizing an immunity from prosecution for a sitting President would not preclude such
prosecution once the President’s term is over or he is otherwise removed from office by resignation or
impeachment.
”).
Also, there's a nugget on page 8 of volume II:
if we had confidence after a thorough investigation of the facts that the President clearly did not commit obstruction of justice, we would so state.
I took the liberty of adding the note you refer to, it was a bit ambiguous as there's another footnote 1091 in the first volume that wasn't as interesting. ;)
– JJJ
1 hour ago
@JJJ - Just noticed. Thanks for digging it up!
– Denis de Bernardy
1 hour ago
add a comment |
Yes, but. Mueller made it crystal clear that he abided by the Department of Justice policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted -- or at least should not, because it basically gets in the way of running the country. That being said, take a look at footnote #1,091, which essentially invites to indict Trump once he's no longer in office.
The text in footnote 1091 on page 178 of the second volume reads:
A possible remedy through impeachment for abuses of power would not substitute for potential
criminal liability after a President leaves office. Impeachment would remove a President from office, but
would not address the underlying culpability of the conduct or serve the usual purposes of the criminal law.
Indeed, the Impeachment Judgment Clause recognizes that criminal law plays an independent role in
addressing an official’s conduct, distinct from the political remedy of impeachment. See U.S. CONST. ART.
I, § 3, cl. 7. Impeachment is also a drastic and rarely invoked remedy, and Congress is not restricted to
relying only on impeachment, rather than making criminal law applicable to a former President, as OLC
has recognized. A Sitting President’s Amenability to Indictment and Criminal Prosecution, 24 Op. O.L.C.
at 255 (“Recognizing an immunity from prosecution for a sitting President would not preclude such
prosecution once the President’s term is over or he is otherwise removed from office by resignation or
impeachment.
”).
Also, there's a nugget on page 8 of volume II:
if we had confidence after a thorough investigation of the facts that the President clearly did not commit obstruction of justice, we would so state.
Yes, but. Mueller made it crystal clear that he abided by the Department of Justice policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted -- or at least should not, because it basically gets in the way of running the country. That being said, take a look at footnote #1,091, which essentially invites to indict Trump once he's no longer in office.
The text in footnote 1091 on page 178 of the second volume reads:
A possible remedy through impeachment for abuses of power would not substitute for potential
criminal liability after a President leaves office. Impeachment would remove a President from office, but
would not address the underlying culpability of the conduct or serve the usual purposes of the criminal law.
Indeed, the Impeachment Judgment Clause recognizes that criminal law plays an independent role in
addressing an official’s conduct, distinct from the political remedy of impeachment. See U.S. CONST. ART.
I, § 3, cl. 7. Impeachment is also a drastic and rarely invoked remedy, and Congress is not restricted to
relying only on impeachment, rather than making criminal law applicable to a former President, as OLC
has recognized. A Sitting President’s Amenability to Indictment and Criminal Prosecution, 24 Op. O.L.C.
at 255 (“Recognizing an immunity from prosecution for a sitting President would not preclude such
prosecution once the President’s term is over or he is otherwise removed from office by resignation or
impeachment.
”).
Also, there's a nugget on page 8 of volume II:
if we had confidence after a thorough investigation of the facts that the President clearly did not commit obstruction of justice, we would so state.
edited 27 mins ago
Alexander O'Mara
2,75411320
2,75411320
answered 1 hour ago
Denis de BernardyDenis de Bernardy
15.5k34270
15.5k34270
I took the liberty of adding the note you refer to, it was a bit ambiguous as there's another footnote 1091 in the first volume that wasn't as interesting. ;)
– JJJ
1 hour ago
@JJJ - Just noticed. Thanks for digging it up!
– Denis de Bernardy
1 hour ago
add a comment |
I took the liberty of adding the note you refer to, it was a bit ambiguous as there's another footnote 1091 in the first volume that wasn't as interesting. ;)
– JJJ
1 hour ago
@JJJ - Just noticed. Thanks for digging it up!
– Denis de Bernardy
1 hour ago
I took the liberty of adding the note you refer to, it was a bit ambiguous as there's another footnote 1091 in the first volume that wasn't as interesting. ;)
– JJJ
1 hour ago
I took the liberty of adding the note you refer to, it was a bit ambiguous as there's another footnote 1091 in the first volume that wasn't as interesting. ;)
– JJJ
1 hour ago
@JJJ - Just noticed. Thanks for digging it up!
– Denis de Bernardy
1 hour ago
@JJJ - Just noticed. Thanks for digging it up!
– Denis de Bernardy
1 hour ago
add a comment |
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
Yes, it does. Page 8 (page 220 in the pdf) of the second volume contains the following lines (just before the conclusion heading):
Finally, we concluded that in the rare case in
which a criminal investigation of the President’s conduct is justified, inquiries to determine
whether the President acted for a corrupt motive should not impermissibly chill his performance
of his constitutionally assigned duties. The conclusion that Congress may apply the obstruction
laws to the President’s corrupt exercise of the powers of office accords with our constitutional
system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law.
I (and some American media outlets, e.g. Vox) interpret that as saying Congress should be the one to determine whether to bring criminal charges. The second volume goes into much more detail, for example under the Legal Defenses To The Application Of Obstruction-Of-Justice Statutes To
The President heading starting on page 159 of the second volume.
add a comment |
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
Yes, it does. Page 8 (page 220 in the pdf) of the second volume contains the following lines (just before the conclusion heading):
Finally, we concluded that in the rare case in
which a criminal investigation of the President’s conduct is justified, inquiries to determine
whether the President acted for a corrupt motive should not impermissibly chill his performance
of his constitutionally assigned duties. The conclusion that Congress may apply the obstruction
laws to the President’s corrupt exercise of the powers of office accords with our constitutional
system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law.
I (and some American media outlets, e.g. Vox) interpret that as saying Congress should be the one to determine whether to bring criminal charges. The second volume goes into much more detail, for example under the Legal Defenses To The Application Of Obstruction-Of-Justice Statutes To
The President heading starting on page 159 of the second volume.
add a comment |
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
Yes, it does. Page 8 (page 220 in the pdf) of the second volume contains the following lines (just before the conclusion heading):
Finally, we concluded that in the rare case in
which a criminal investigation of the President’s conduct is justified, inquiries to determine
whether the President acted for a corrupt motive should not impermissibly chill his performance
of his constitutionally assigned duties. The conclusion that Congress may apply the obstruction
laws to the President’s corrupt exercise of the powers of office accords with our constitutional
system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law.
I (and some American media outlets, e.g. Vox) interpret that as saying Congress should be the one to determine whether to bring criminal charges. The second volume goes into much more detail, for example under the Legal Defenses To The Application Of Obstruction-Of-Justice Statutes To
The President heading starting on page 159 of the second volume.
Doesn't this clearly state that Mueller's team made a conscious decision to NOT to evaluate "conduct" that might lead to an indictment of the President?
Yes, it does. Page 8 (page 220 in the pdf) of the second volume contains the following lines (just before the conclusion heading):
Finally, we concluded that in the rare case in
which a criminal investigation of the President’s conduct is justified, inquiries to determine
whether the President acted for a corrupt motive should not impermissibly chill his performance
of his constitutionally assigned duties. The conclusion that Congress may apply the obstruction
laws to the President’s corrupt exercise of the powers of office accords with our constitutional
system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law.
I (and some American media outlets, e.g. Vox) interpret that as saying Congress should be the one to determine whether to bring criminal charges. The second volume goes into much more detail, for example under the Legal Defenses To The Application Of Obstruction-Of-Justice Statutes To
The President heading starting on page 159 of the second volume.
answered 1 hour ago
JJJJJJ
7,23922660
7,23922660
add a comment |
add a comment |
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